Noticed Meeting CM Pittman & CM Peluso RE School Closures within City's District

Noticed Meeting CM Pittman & CM Peluso RE School Closures within City's District — Dec 15, 2025

>> It's good. Mornin has everyone week. We got to go ahead and get started and have our conversation. I'm gonna go awry and the table and asked everyone to introduce themselves. Aaron, Start with you. >> It's on K Hi, Aaron. Abney chief of current planning with the Planning Department. >> Morning and Randolph, the Office of Economic Development. I Good Morning Travis Jeffrey Chief Housing Community Development Division. Good morning. Happy holidays. All there with the Duval County School Board District 4. Good morning. Happy holidays to the police, the District 7. Good Morning, Carol. Joseph Marx Point. >> And thank you all so much for being here this morning. This meeting is set up basically because you and I we're concerned about closures in our districts. And I got to tell you, I'm very disappointed what has been happening. And also we have been listening. We've been going around listening to what the residents and the teachers have to say. So before we get in our meeting, I also would like to say that Dr bring near and I will a meeting in the next few weeks to discuss some opportunities and options. But before I go there, I would like Darryl Willie, if he would just give maybe update us what has happened in the last few weeks as it regards to our Brown and Long Branch Elementary. >> Yes, and I and all the reason we can move into some of the core pieces here. So thank you once again for put this meeting together. If we go all the way back, we as a district, a lot has changed the landscape of education over the last not just a couple years, but the last decade or so. When you think about the number of students that are now you have many choices options as parents to choose many different choices, including traditional public charters, home virtual all these options, which actually pull away from a number of our students every single every single year. And that is sort of let us to the place where now we have schools that are now under utilized indoor under enrolled. So heads hence the conversation we're having now about long branch and many of the situations that we have the under utilization and under Roman are happening in communities that don't have the growth and development necessarily inside of those communities. So it is either steady or stagnant or declining in those areas. So that in addition to what we see is school choice options of families getting issues, many options, you know, see our schools now being an early lead allies are enrolled. So as a district, of course, understanding our responsibility to be fiscally responsible for our community and taxpayers. We have to have conversations about it. And these are unfortunate conversations. And I as the representative district 4 sit in the middle of it because many of the schools that are affected by sit in my area, the most recent one is this. Our Brown in Long branch, even just last year are Brown an RV Daniels. Both of those are dedicated magnet schools, gifted and talented magnet schools already combined last year because of under utilization and aroma in each of those areas to separate neighborhoods, but dedicated mag says schools to put those together. And that happened last year. This year, our Brown, even with both of those school, still was not utilized fully. The school is not utilized. So now you have that situation and long branch, which is under utilized as well. But such a striving school and I go back. The schools are successful. They're amazing. Great work is happening. The outcomes are there. That is not the issue. The issue is more. There's not enough students for the seats that are in the school. So now the because of every year we look at the various school options. We said, you know what there? Let's look at our Brown and long branch because of their proximity because of that neighborhood. Let's see about putting those together or have a conversation about it. Each of those sacked there was there was group sex and and sort of groups that came together to talk about that in a number of meetings. And now we're at the place where the superintendent recommended the the consolidation of both of those schools. That was the recommendation of the superintendent. That recommendation came to the board. I as somebody who was against the consolidation and wanted to explore other options propose that we actually push that out. And that's exactly where we are. Now. That recommendation is still holds, but it's pushed out. So it was supposed to be implemented next year now be implemented in the 27 28 school year. So we have now process now. That's why we actually are able to have this conversation because there is some time there's a window of time that we can have this conversation and see what could be done to sort of have additional resources reported there. So that's where we are right now. It is still that notion is that is still being consolidated. That was the vote, but not until 27 28, which gives us time. If we do want to do something in between to sort of change with that looks like. >> One of the questions I wanted to as well as you just mentioned, that every year you a look at a guess areas, if it is schools need to be closed in those areas. Is there an opportunity for us to develop maybe a 3 to 5 year plan now that we know that there some challenges in these areas that are in the urban core, you know, good question. >> And there's already a five-year capital plan that we already have. So we look at that 5 year capital plan. Look at it every year, but it's also 5 years out. So I think this is a perfect opportunity not just to look at this long branch situation. But look at any other schools that are at the back end are sort of middle of that five-year plan to see like what what other actions we can take as a group and has to be a collaborative effort. You know that you say this to me all the time. It has to be, yes, the school peace. But there's all this these other activities that happen outside of the school that aren't necessarily our responsibility, but we could support and vice versa. So, yeah, I think looking at that 5 year capital plan, we should we have these meetings regularly to see where we are because every year there's another year that gets out on that 5 year plan and potentially another set of schools. So we should be talking about 5 years out. And I think that would help the scenario as well. >> Absolutely. And one of the reasons I bought this experts here this morning to maybe have a discussion with the school boar regarding a real 5 year plan and real time because, you know, a few years ago when Dr Greene was here, you know, I was all excited about having some schools in new schools, Bill. We have now rebound in the district. But I don't know what that means going into the future, right? And so my colleague who has a school in his district that has been on that happen a lot probably a few times or a merger and I'd like for him to just kind of talk and give his perspective for sure. >> Thank you, Councilman and and thank you to a school board member, Willie, for being here. And I think what what their just said is so well, you know, it was says, look, when it was right, I'm going to say some little bit more controversial. The state legislature has completely eviscerated public education in this state. And they have gone after its counties like Duval County. It's evident there can be more evidence. And so as Harrell says, yep, there's 500 different choices when when you when you queue folks too many options and and allow for those left now for a public money to have to go to those options, it completely eviscerate the traditional public schools that are neighborhood schools that everyone loves and that we know our assets for our neighborhoods in our communities. We've heard it from the from the land use side. We've heard a lot of, you know, realtors and folks yet traditional schools nearby. That's a great value. Add for that community said a close one. It's hugely detrimental. It's an economic driver. And it's also, you know, a public safety measure. So there's a lot of concerns that I have about a long branch closing down. I also think and I'm glad we do have housing experts here. The area that's known for he's going to see immense growth in the next 5 to 6 years. Everything from lot J which will probably I I imagine in the next 2 years we're going to see a a long-term vision for lot J. Looks like there's a lot of land, right? There were people are going to be moving into downtown pretty much everything I think east of Main Street, his own within, you know, long branch as well. And then you throw in the east side community, which is about to see a massive influx of funds. Many are many of those dollars to pose going housing. So you're just seeing a lot of growth, future growth and to shut down a school. Now it's just we are we're it's a completely misguided approach to how we should be looking at this on top of the fact that we know we all know that consolidation. We all know about the pain and Kurt that this community in the city had gone through during those years and we saw white flight, we saw we saw issues that that saw the school district really suffer and so we can solve it. And in doing so part of the deal was we were not going to close down traditional schools. We're not going to ignore some of these historically black neighborhoods. And yet here we are. Here we are. And so, you know, my concerns are was the vision right on top of the fact that we've got our friends in Tallahassee who are, you know, cut us off at the knees. But but here we have the ability to make sure that we are fighting for these communities and for these neighborhoods that we kind of came together on back in 1968, said, yep, we're going to try to make sure that we keep these communities hole. I understand a lot of these communities right now we're seeing housing issues. You know, we're seeing a lot of renters are seeing a lot of folks, you know, kind of kind of that some of these neighborhoods getting older. Well, we're about to see a huge influx of young families. And with those families are going to be children that should be getting a great education, which they can get at Long Branch Elementary. And so I just kind want to make that known. That's one of my biggest concerns. Not only is the council member, but some of these hearing from the community. So so I'm really excited to kind of see what we're looking at. But I want to make sure that the community is aware of this, that the school board members are aware of it. You know what? We have a superintendent who it's my understanding. Incredibly smart guy. He's not from Duval County, right? That's okay. But maybe doesn't know everything about the decision-making of the past. Maybe doesn't know everything about what how we got here and maybe doesn't, you know, see sort of the value behind these the schools and what they mean for these communities in these neighborhoods. So so that's why I'm here. And I appreciate Councilwoman. I want to take up too much time can be a little bit of hot air. And I guess for me. >> Understanding when you all close a school, why can't we that council members be involved in the process? So, you know, when this cold schools were closed in my district, it was kind of like a afterthought. So that's why I wanted to call this meeting today because I don't want to have like a >> a bad taste that were not included in the process. And you all know what isn't needed to help us keep the schools open. You know, I feel a little I feel bad about Long branch because they've come so far, you know, and it's kind of like the achievements that they've made, that they're not really been recognize for it to to stay open. And and what matters to the community should matter to all of us, because that's how we got here. And I just I just want to know, you know, the threshold that I heard was 700 and I'm not sure it's less than 700 in order to keep school open, understand a budget. But how do we how do we come to some sort of compromise? You know, I guess is bigoted me and, you know, to understand how do we help and how do we partner and bring the city together the school board in jus a joint responsibility of how we go forward. >> Yeah, that's that's a good question. And I just ate like I it's one of the hardest things ever have to do is to close or consolidate its cool. I mean, it's just the worst and I've had to do a number of times and one of the things that how we just have not justified it. But >> we were we had the plane were building brand new schools were like, hey, we want to make sure if you're close or consolidate your going into a brand new building because it into the day. Yeah, we can sit up here and say how we want to hold onto these buildings with their old and he's not a learning environment that any of our students should be forced into, especially if it's an older building. So where do you put in Cannes Street the dollars? And that's essentially how we have the mass of the city's plan. You saw a new Rutledge Pearson. How is the state's Henry Ball high school? So you have brand-new buildings in our districts that I mean, that hasn't happened in decades. And I think that's the positive of it. But at the end of the day that there's that there's a sacrifice was like if you have a brand-new building, something has to give. And I think yes. So I think there's an opportunity for us to both worked together in it and figure things out. At the end of the day, it's about we have to have the dollars to be able to support the students, not only in that school but the other schools because the problem always is if you have a smaller school, it is not it actually costs more to run. That's cool. That a large school. That's why you have the 700 number and the 700 numbers. The efficiency numbers like like your house, like at a certain point, like you get to a place, where are your operating on an efficient level because you have enough dollars that are coming in and it supports all of the sort of bills that you have. So that's why you have that 700 member. But it doesn't mean that you can't have schools that are below that because we know that's the case and a lot of the neighborhoods. So the question that I think we have to ask is who gets priority on who gets the small schools? I think that's the question that I I will continue to ask of this board. And superintendent, where does that go? Because now I've said this before I said the meeting just before it's done its part like we've done our part. We've consolidated we did what we need to do now know who else is going to sort of hold some of the broad and I have it all be on the backs of district 4 district 5. And I think, but I do think there's a conversation have ahead of time to sort of get ourselves in a place where the money is there that we see the growth. We talked to folks and they see down the line and say there may be, you know, 10200 families that could be potentially be coming in. So those are the conversation. We have that wide open to it. And I think we do. You have more of a collaborative spirit when it comes to making the decisions because it does affect not just the schools that affects neighborhoods and the whole city. So, yeah, I I'm I'm all for it. >> And I think, you know, one of the things, you know, I like to know the data source. How do you all you know, what do you look at when? >> The surroundings areas? You said it economic development in these areas when the schools are closed and so speaking in heaven, Mr and off, if you can just kind of tell the audience, what are we looking? What are we look at when we're talking about new development and is there a way and he's just I'm not trying to you to get you to commit to anything. But if we looking at in the future, a 3 to 5 year plan, even though they have won. But I think we need to have a a real one and real time. What do you look at and how do we pointing different corporations? I know in the out and out of areas of diff in certain deer districts that they have large, they need large pieces of property, right? And so how do we merge in have the conversation bring in new companies in and developers in who would be interested in building in certain areas in our community coming forward? >> Yes, really, really quick want to make one more point. So this this situation combines both my district district 4 and district 5 Reggie Blount and because of scheduling avenues, both here, he's actually going to be coming in in the next probably 5 to 6 minutes. And we're going to switch out because of sunshine regulations. So just want to let folks know if I did about he's going to be coming in, but definitely both very concerned and interested in the conversation. And I'll catch up. I we have our staff members from Duval County here as well. That gives us a story about that. >> So to the councilman's question, I think in general economic development, you know, in order to get activity and investment in certain areas that have been underfunded or really, you know, have been really you can also to the distressed areas, which is one of them to school district that we're talking about here. Really 2 shows that the city is investing in those areas in which we are. So I think we've seen a record amount of projects in the last 2 years, at least on the east side with the Phoenix are still strict. We've seen a handful projects now in Springfield of which are bringing not just commercial development. Swisher now has made a major investment in the area. So I think things like that will help us gain some footing and actually get more investment because there's a herd mentality. So collectively, I think we're on a good path here, at least on the east side and in that area. Now with the CBA dollars, also being I looked at the health infrastructure in general grants and to help small businesses. So collectively, it really comes down to private sector folks knowing that the city has the certain area priority, which we have. So even just in broadly speaking Northwest Jacksonville with also seen a record amount of projects. And that's one area that the mayor's asked us to focus on of which where in Northwest Jax will houses most of our economically distressed areas in city centers. Traction is in the city. So we've had a number of projects. Thomas Foods recently announced there are stab wishing operation Northwest Jax will Baker sports. I can go on and on how we've already kind of seen this, but it will take time. You know, some of these areas have have sat dormant from commercial activity perspective for many years. But we are think on the right path, but it won't be overnight. But with commercial development comes, I think more residential development. So as I just mentioned, the Phoenix Arts District Project, they've just now put forth affordable housing project of which I think will help bring more commercial. But a lot of times it's a chicken and egg things in certain instances, as we're seeing downtown to what you need, the residential, the commercial for some, it would be great to have them both the same time. But I think on the commercial side, we're on a good path, but it's not going to be overnight. So I think if we have some dialogue with the school districts and the school board, give them the understanding that we're working on getting those commercial, you know, more of a more commercial viability and certain school districts, I think that will strengthen the case to hopefully attract more residential units as well. The support the schools. Thank you so much. And Aaron, that like for you to Todd, the planning of >> of our city and strategically where we're seeing the growth. >> I mean, right now what we are seeing a lot of it is a lot of a development is occurring out outside of like the 2.95 bell, mainly because that's all the land that undeveloped. But the planning department is working on figuring out how do we get more development within our urban core and in our area areas that are closest to, you know, already established neighborhoods and transportation corridors are major transportation corridors. I know right now some of the projects that we have going on is the east side overlay that it that is currently being worked on in order to address housing within that neighborhood, keep it in the character of the established like neighborhood and also addressing some of the nonconformities that those lot have when you are relating them to our current zoning code. So we're trying to make it easier for people to come in and and infill projects of housing white. Let's get the lots that have been sitting vacant for a while and let's get houses on him. And we're also working with the housing team to figure out where those issues and how can we address them to get the houses on those properties. Also, we we just recently finished our ldr committee, which is our Land Development regulations committee. And they be given some recommendations on how the city can address affordable housing and also resilient design measures. So we had that project going on where where in the city can we address hired in cities and appropriate locations while also providing affordable housing? So these are just some projects that that the planning Department is currently working on in order to address the housing need for the city and and again in the most appropriate locations, which are areas that have already utilities and in transportation corridors and in that front. >> And that kind of said, thank you so much. >> Thank councilman. And yet it to that point, right? And I I mean, on the back councilmember, I forgot the Phoenix is a part of his own for Long branch. Yeah. Phoenix is about to see a massive uptick in higher density properties. Franklin arms and Eastside. I believe that's going to get a complete it. They may do a ton of work on that property to put another 120 50 units there after they kind of rehab everything or do what they're going to do. That's the Housing authority's project right there. Like we're talking hundreds of units in and a half, half a block or whatever else. So like, that's what that's what you have to offer in the urban core is that we have these abilities to kind of build up and put a bunch of families in there. And that's what it's going to be. It's going to be a lot of young people, a lot of families. So, you know, we which may be cognizant of that, right? Like I just I'm so concerned that people are recognizing if they think it's going to be, you know, some small subdivision that gets built in part of the urban core getting that's not the plan, nor should it be the plan we need density in the city. We absolutely do. Especially the urban core and schools like this only have much to gain from it. So so so make sure I put that out there that care. >> And thank you for making that point. And I do feel that having this conversation now probably will. And I know I won't be here after 2027. >> But to have a look here and see what the U.S.. >> But to be able you be able for you to carry on the options that we can potentially have. >> Good morning and how you doing. Thank you for joining this ridge. A bullet here, but I just want to make sure I don't want to have just have a conversation, but to have an action plan and the implementation plan because we know what's going to happen to the east side, which is nothing but good things. But we want to make sure that we have our Navy's neighborhood schools as well as the as our charter school, if need be. >> So with that, also, like for Travis of you would give us an overview of the the housing, what's in the pipeline and what area as well. >> Yeah, good morning. So we all know that the mayor's initiative is affordable housing at your top initiative and we've got a just a tonn of affordable housing developments in the pipeline. Now we just had the app