Public noticed Meeting 2025-811

>> All right. Good. Good afternoon, everybody. Thank you for coming to data is public notice meeting we're having this today because we initially wanted to have a couple weeks ago, but just a little bit confusion. But you are here now. And so the current bill that we're talking about, it's actually it's been deferred. And the reason for that is because I want to have community input from you all today as well as this weekend and have my own community town hall at the Southeast Regional Library on Saturday at have been 01:00PM, right? All right. So for anybody in the audience or anybody at home listening and we'll have another meeting at 01:00PM at the Southeast Regional Library, which is off of the parkway area in District 11 as well, too. So without being said, I'll start with the introduction to my left. We're down in district 13. The beaches are all areas district 11. All right. So I want to make sure that we're just pretty much to the point as to what the purpose of the sessions that the legislation is. So I have Mr Breaker here as well as on Richard, as well to kind of talk a little bit about what this is, what brought this up, right? We've been talking about this for a couple months now. And you have a lot of concerns with the shelter's. Well, 2 items, a diamond has multiple times brought up the concerns as well. So I think as a whole, the spirit of this is a good thing. It's just a matter of how we decided to make sure that it, you know, if it's for everybody. So I'll let the dialogue started out as a dime if you want to just have him with us. >> Yeah, I appreciate for first of all, thanks for having U.S. notice meeting. If you don't know, Florida law says that I can't talk to are all of us because he filed a bill that just means that we can't talk about it unlike the hallway or we have to do a public meeting that's get everyone to be able to hear what we talk about. And so this is the first time we've ever really been able talk about this other than saying, let's have a meeting. So I understand the bill ultimately wants it. Talks about going from 6 day holds a 3 day old. Best practice around the country for big cities is a three-day hold 6 day old. And you know, he's been Jacksonville's practice and the if you don't know me, I'm a dog. I like cats and other animals also been like I'm a dog. I like and like singularly obsessed with getting Jacksonville's be the best city in the country when it comes to animal welfare Easter, one animal welfare organization on time ago. And so that's where my heart is and whatever the right answer is for the dogs and cats. That's what I mean before. I don't have anything else that makes people and find it does make people mad. Excellent. So that's where I'll be. That being said. The upside to going from 6 days to 3 from my point of view is that there will be less time for a dog or cat to be in the shelter before they can start to be adopted out some dogs. We find that side of the street are adoptable. The moment we find them, you can find a box of puppies like immediately. Those talks are just going to fly out of the shelter and we want them in the shelter for as little time as possible from the behavior appointed. You very bad to have dogs in the shelter for too long from a health point of view than to have dogs in a shelter for too long. And then from a space management point, do you want to have been shipped dogs like puppies or whatever, really easily adoptable dogs for their for too long, occupy space. So that's the reason to reduce it. And that's why animal offer people like jhs and some say that's what we should do. On the flip side in Jacksonville, we've got a really big city and it's 825 square miles. And you asked that number can kind of changes. I think there should be an official number. And so here's the risk is that I lose my dog for whatever reason. I don't call animal control to see my dog is there. I don't know out of town or the case that happened in Orange County that I was personally involved with 2 weeks ago or 3 weeks ago. We had that run was Baker acted, had a dog in his apartment and he's in the hospital. And we only found out later that that is in the hospital. It's always at Orange County Animal Control it as a three-day haul. If we had to figure all that out, he meant a loss is Dr. So that's the risk is that someone lose their job. So the subtleties to this is not always an easy answer. And I don't know what exactly the right answer is for Jacksonville that eye. But I know we have a lot of animal. Well for folks in the off and the audience have a lot of faith in the all I know you guys have big hearts and I want to hear what they have to say also. So thank you for having the meeting. I want to think about the subtleties between like a chipped dog or cat and an ship dog, a puppy that's found on the side of the road versus, you know, like what clearly is a family dog that got lost, you know, and how how do we get to that in a way that makes sense for Jacksonville? So I'm not in a rush to get a bill through. I typically am one usually like get a bill passed on this one. I'm okay. If we were going carefully and having meetings and getting community input because the animal control an animal for communities very and if we can get everybody aligned and excited about a policy that will have a better outcome at the end of the day, we just well, it's just we're unique group of people. It's a we need to. We need to have a line. Thanks. >> Excellent point. I know that when I proposed legislation immediately, I thought of you, which is why want to have this this conversation? Because I know you have, if anything, the best input from any other council member, it says I've been counseled the last 2 years, 3 years now. I think there's only been 2 individuals out of the 19 that really have supported the kcps its U.S. too, through the budget we funded. I know that's where you came in as pretty strong as what he wanted to come stronger and ultimately we met on the middle. Right. But the reason for funding is because our shelters, I capacity and that's one of the biggest reasons for this legislation right now. You know, we're talking about expanding the shelter, but also we need to look at it holistically. It's OK versus we're going to expand because we need to expand that. That was another way that we can also the trees, the occupancy there. And this is one of those reasons. One of the ways we can do that by still offering a good home for for animals. One of the things Mr, break about up and all that you come up pretty says there is when whenever some council members last week asking some questions they were worried about you, the nation, right? That's a misconception here. They're also worried about. We'll have. Is that the 3 days one of the dogs go. You mentioned how you have a dog mean Travis Hunter has been around for about a year now in the shelter. Maybe more. >> Right, right eye if this gets. So the point is that >> a dog is not going to leave the shelter after 3 days. I want to make sure that week here the air out to make sure that everybody understands what's going on. So with that being said, Mr Breaker, you please know Mike is there and it's being not just hit the button. And just to confirm, Evan, we have this being streams are recorded. Perfect. Thank you and just state your name and address our reputation, please. >> Michael Barker, imagine some final on division chief Emma Care and Tax Services. So here today to talk about stray. Hold on. I want to talk about the purpose of this policy change this policy change. We want to move with 3 days trailed for unidentified pats to reduce overcrowding and improve welfare. We will maintain a full day 6 day hold for pets with verifiable identification to protect responsible owners. Aline a CPS with national best practices used by hive on municipal shelters. Just like us. Just like the ones here in Florida. Our current conditions and operational reality SBS runs anywhere from 40 to 60 dogs. Overcapacity in a building designed for 264 overcrowding. Create sanitation problems, disease pressure, behavioral decline, and safety risks extended holds worse in these conditions and directly an impact and welfare. So why three-day hold for unidentified pets? Most incoming pets have no ID and no verified on a trip. National data shows 70 to 80% of return owners happen within the first 48 hours to 3 days. Plenty of enough time. Hps alone has a 15% return owner. 8 was on par with most national shelters. So that means 85% of the animals that come in do not get returned to their owners. >> That Mr. Perry just missed you mind. If I ask questions and this isn't like a fancy meeting, the 15%. Do you have that? Do you have numbers like what does that look like? How many dogs is that? So C? >> So returning owners from January, 1st up until yesterday, Monday talking this sorry we had we had 325 dogs that were returned to owners over the past 11 months. >> So that's E and just just do have this most. This happened in 48 hours. But it's like the how do we know that? Like a tracking? Yeah. >> So so as far as national data, it's it's 3 days. But for us, it's usually. >> Thank you. My daughters missing. I'll be down there like in in a minute like grab. That would be a look at the Cannes. But like you telling me, like most people get there within 2 days, 3 days for a streamers. >> For national data shows 70 to 80% are happening within the first 48 hours, actually. But do we track it so that we know like it's date? What? What happens day 3, 4, 5, 6, That's my question wrecked. Yeah. We know exactly when they came in when they get adopted or transfer to Texas. >> All right. Longer she holds. I think you mentioned Murray increased stress, illness and behavior problems shorter holds reduce length of stay and help prevent overcrowding. 60 holds one of the things that came up for pets with verifiable identification. So we want to send a formal addendum to Councilman R Us that clarifies the pets with verifiable ID or see the full 6 day hold verifiable ID includes an active registered microchip, a result haggling to confirm owner or a valid license. This ensures that Francois owners will have full due process Knackered notification. One of the things that came up was are improvements to honor a notification. So it's it's just partnered with 6 years city's call center. We created an escalation alert. So we have a escalation alert for a lot of different things like there's a dangerous dog that's biting people or some other community risk. What happens is 6 years. She gets the call and then escalation e-mail goes out to all the leadership staff. So up until this point, if somebody called and said, hey, my dog is there in New Hampshire, we have we had e-mails and stuff like that. But this is now taking a step further south. That does happen. An escalation e-mails can be sent out to our whole leadership team saying, hey, there's a person in Rhode Island. They said that their dogs there can give them a call. We also created an hbs lost and found Facebook page where we're going to post every stray dog entering the shelter and and is going to post it in real time. One of the issues that I think was mentioned was on our website and how its older and it's really hard to determine if it's a lost dog, found dog adopted a dog. So we think that this is going to be able to help out that. But we also have and they're here. We also have one of that thankfully in Jacksonville and the largest lost and found pages, I think in Florida with 80,000 people following set, that's definitely help as well. Another thing that is pretty cool. So we've already done through our Bows Hope initiative, Eden, Free Microchip clinics. We're going to spend that. And now we have another veterinarian have other veterans that are signed on to help us and every pen from the nose first coast around this pets signed on and they're going to start helping us a lot of that, too, as well as Ghs. We actually the first one set up. It's going to be Saturday November. 29 from 10 to 4 free microchips. Every pet is going to sponsor the 150 of them. And I think just another 150, we also jhs it here today. They're not know it in agreement with this. Yeah, 100%. So I think you mentioned that we've been talking about this for a couple months has trailed, but myself in Jhs been talking about this for the past year. I sort of main society for yes, those in the audience, by the way. >> All right. So they're they're also on board with this 100. Are they also subject to 60 stray hold right now, currently? Yes, as well. So by this legislation passing, they'll be able to do 3. They hold as well. Are they also experiencing the same problems you guys are experiencing, which is double booking on the kennels or or to pass a tea or what's what's their deal? >> No, so they have a much shorter length of stay. The not so dogs are coming in. They're going out much quicker. The reason being not only are they just an amazing shelter have been around for a while and people know them. But also they're they're they're nonprofit facility. They don't have control. So they start off at a different spot than we do. Their their owner surrenders are pretty much ready to go as far as adaptability owes and straight as they take same thing that you take in some injured animals. But our officers, when they go out almost 100% of the animals, they bring in their something that's going on that we need to fix before we get them to that adoption floor. So it's a little bit different. So they they do do adopt out animals quicker than we do. But they start to the 60's, do it. >> I know you're at you're talking about like marketing efforts and all that. But let's just kind of keep it to this went on for a second. Oh, sure. You mention verifiable ID's for pet owners. So I just understand they have a chip, even with this legislation. If it goes through for the 3 days now, will that mean that you'll still keep the dogs that they have a chip for 6 days? Is that what I'm understanding or if it's verifiable on? >> So if they just come in with a microchip that we can't, we can't research if unfortunately people get their dog shipped or the dogs are Egypt, but then they don't register that chip. So just goes back to the initial implant facility. Sometimes don't go back to that, but sometimes will be able to get this chip was implanted ghs. Let's call them a try to information or this trip wasn't on plan that this veterinarian, but sometimes its not, Richard, all and we there's nothing that we can do. That is verifiable. Yes. And if I lose my dog. >> And out of here, I'm somewhere in Miami. We have a three-day stray hold. Now. Does that mean you guys will hold my dog for 6 days? >> Correct. Yes. Of data like that dog that you would house from us and microchips in your name. So if you came in, we realize that it is a dog that's my chips has known or it stays in for 6 days instead of 3 got it use. That was one of the biggest issues people high was saying, hey. >> Well, what about people that have dogs that there are, you know, they'll be adopted a look at another home. I want to look at provisions where we have the clawbacks in the sense of like protections for those pet owners that know that they have their dog. They're more than likely. Are they maybe see it for these? You know, they realize there for, you know, after the number for it. So I just give me some assurance that you guys was to hold them there, knowing that they have that the ones that will not be held for more than 3 days of the ones that don't have any kind of identification, correct. Those will be adopted immediately if somebody wants to adopt the most. >> After yesterday, 3, they'll get fixed and or if they're already fixed in 8 the be they be able to be a doctor right away. Okay. >> Yes. Let us on this one point. This understands that you do that. >> Correct. Yeah. So if there's an actual name and phone number on anything, 6, they'll play, you know, they're making now. We would still hold for 6 days because that name is on there, too. So that's something that we can go back to. Our officers will check like or in other ways to try to read them. >> So the league odds that are just going to be under this legislation. >> And end the of this new written policy and it is legislation that I see you're gonna probably gate. Oh, yeah, and we are to detail because I do think that whatever we do, it's got to be replicable. People need to hoard is is that it's going to yeah that happened that somebody is going to get out, get out, lose their right to their all and it's going to be. >> Know for sure. We already have it in policy right now. Currently we call they can the like, no, no, no hold. So it's the same thing. And I do want to clarify if you are out of town of Miami and you can't make it back by the 6th day, but we're in contact with you were holding the dog still, you know, we're going to talk to you. We're going to try to get that dog back to you, which try to get the dog back to California. It came in here are our facility and it was staying with somebody. They didn't take care of it. We found out who the owner was and try to get back to California. So we'll try everything to get the dog back to its home. Ok, good to know. >> Let's talk about the potential. I don't miss your time and wants to work on this so that so I knew that senator has a new CPS somewhere in the South side or towards the beaches, whatever. How will that affect this and how that if anything, will help you guys? I like how do you how does this work? >> For sure. So one of the hardest parts about a CBS is its location. We have a ton of animals. We need to spread them out. And someone mentioned how many square feet, 825 square miles. We need to be everywhere. And we're doing that currently with like events. But having a place that has, you know, an address in times that we can have for additional adoption facility. It would be amazing. I would definitely help us with space as well. All right. You could proceed with came closer works free pet tags is another thing that where we are we've been doing to help out with this whenever there like before 4th of July on before like big storms when we know that's going to be more lost pets. We always post on our Facebook that we will provide free pet tags. We purchase to a pet and grading sheen now like 6 or 7 months ago. So that's been helpful to just another thing to get people pets back with their owners. >> The grade with the fact that they should. >> Petco Love loss. Yes. Was the best thing ever and make sure we integrated fully integrated. And Petco love loss is one of the coolest things ever. It's probably the biggest change to return owners that has happened in the past 20 years. That's in saying it's facial-recognition software for dogs and cats and it works in Frazee ways. And if every black hat almost black cats look the same, this software can pick out which black cat you lost. We had a cat that came in that did not look anything like the picture. I'm not really sure how how it worked. But this this cat was lady came in said that my cats here, she got a notification from Petco Love lost and she can reclaim the cat. The cat wasn't in the best condition. Could shoot missing it for like 6 months. But it was amazing. So what we already have in place can tell you. So we do. Multiple microchips. Microchips can didn't take an during exams. Immediate owner, contact attempts with any ideas found real-time lost and found matching through Petco Love, lost dedicated microchip investigator who has facilitated reunions of pets missing for months or years. The guy that he's a volunteer that we work with, he's not even in the state is in New York. So there's a chip that we cannot figure out. We send it to him and he's been amazing in figuring out these microchips. He's helped us and big ways. We did a staff training within maybe like 6 or 7 months ago and paid search mission. All right. So I think 0.1, the things that I would love to do more of and figure out how we can and I hope this meeting we can start brainstorming is more community education and prevention. So many pet owners do not know to update the chips to license pats, to keep tags and collars or check the shelter quickly. We want to do more outreach in that regard. That will increase on lost pet recovery steps. Microchipping licensing importance are free ID tags and maybe some others and how to use the H P S and other lost and found Facebook groups. Transparency in public access I think was one. So all strays opposed to quickly online and on the SBS lost and found Facebook page. I don't know if many people know this, but our animal man system is called communion as soon as an animal is is taken in and it goes up on the website. So there's that's the one good thing about the Web site they get on the Web site. Quickly in 2, it's pretty much it for me. >> So I'm gonna open up to the public, not so we have some participation. But I want to hear from anybody in the audience that today's Sessions may lead to just talk about. The concern is not to talk about any individuals and also talk about maybe some solutions as well as whatever we could do in the future to to help a CPS as well. I do have my own ideas and some time and has his own ideas to. You've already mentioned some. So I will open it up to anybody. If you want to speak, just raise your hand and then I will recognize you. Does anyone want to speak to the audience? >> Oh, come on. Don't be shy. And a lot of you guys, this is it is it is not a shy group. He says I just identify yourself and your and your name and address for the record and then yeah, I just it was time. >> Vicky Nelson and I'm on the Southside of Jacksonville. That's thank you. Nice to me. Embers ice me too. I can't. And I feel like I'm turning my back to every day. What I did. Rory and I can vouch. I feel like I feel like this room is kind of divided like were here to argue or something. But we're not like we're all in the same team for sure. Mean, breaking about I was in his office long before chief Barker was here saying, hey, whenever a new person comes, we need more money. They got to be paid more. The staff knees. I mean, I've been advocating for changes for animals and the staff and volunteers for a long time. So I wanted to be clear, we're on the same page here just for probably going to get to a down different roads. I guess I told you before. I'm from the Lost Pets Page to help Karen admin the page. And we see every day, obviously all day lost pets just all over town. You know, from one side of Jacksonville to the other, the biggest concern that I have with pushing this through so quickly, lots of great ideas. Lots of new things coming down the road. I think the machine to the tags on the dogs is awesome. But none of that is in place now like there's a microchip clinic down the road. But there wasn't 1, 4, months ago to get citizens prepared for. Hey, everybody, get your pet microchipped because we're about to change the stray hold. It's not the law to have your ship but in dog and a lot of people think it hurts. I'm like that's a myth. >> You know, a lot of older dogs, especially don't have them because maybe their event wasn't pushing it. You know, 15 years ago when they first went to the vet. And so I just think it all needs to be slow down until we can get everything in place and functioning properly. The website, the website. I don't understand why it's so antiquated because finding I can find everything you guys did yesterday on the website, right? So I can to find out what's happening with the dogs that quick on the website like it doesn't make sense that we can update every government department, but we can't help the animals like that is I don't know what you know. I don't know what department does that or who does it or whatever. But that's a question I have is, you know, and I saw the I hate my back and I saw that message curing it like 3 in the morning. I saw that a CPS last page and that we've been begging for the street. The dogs found on and it makes it so much easier to reunite a pat. If somebody says I found this dog, you know, on Bay Street, a lot of people opposed to dog and say found this dog in my yard whenever Dean is where your yard is. So now I saw on their face, they created it has the addresses of could were dog was found. My concern is it's like one more like I feel like we're already short staffed. Now we have a lost dog pays. We have a Web site has to be updated. We have a fallen think we have so many pages. No business functions has 5 different Facebook pages for their business unless their businesses, 5 different, major different categories. So understand why we can't get it all on one page and get everybody in town to know about that page, get some advertising, whatever we need to do to get the word out and get updated. I do have questions. And before I even start the ordinances to a to 5 a 1, 1, right. There's a lot more to it than the three-day stray hold. >> Yeah, and I have Mister Bricker extreme was redone with your question you want? Yeah. I had a lot of questions about its. I don't know if what we're going to. That's a case where you have a seat. I haven't come up. Are you want to have to go ahead? I'm sure the when we last a certain head it's pretty much tied up. A lot of different things in Tooele. It's. >> Yeah. So like and saw on the tethering of dogs we taking out like the weight of chains. They can be on wonder why we would take the weight off the chains when that's the people who are putting chains on dogs or not, people who are going to worry about the weight unless we can regulate the wait. If that makes sense, you see dogs with huge, heavy chains on and before the the ordinance stated exactly like how much it could way before it was not as violation. And then I saw also for 2 other dogs. It no longer requires for them to have shelter that has a level floor and a roof. So that was a question, a bench. The it looks like that was 2 other in Surrey Dogs at large was a really big question because I believe dogs at larger stray dog. And that's completely been taken completely out of the ordinance altogether. According to what I do, I have like I don't know if I have the right copy because I ask if there was a new and there wasn't one on record and I don't think we don't have a new one that I see. This is just from the last meeting that you are. >> Yeah, we that was the first that we have the amendment. So animal animals at large are completely taken the ordinance altogether. So does that mean no one can be cited for stray dog anymore? And I love him. And it's especially that and then I saw that affidavits from witnesses are no longer acceptable that actually CEOs had to witnesses themselves. So that seemed like call a co and say aye or AC and a space since witnessing my neighbor do this witnessing, then I have to sign an affidavit that eyewitness that. But now the affidavits are out. There's just a few. Well, there's not a few. There's a lot of questions because I realized after pulling it up, there's a lot more to this than this. Just a stray hold. Okay. So thank you so much. I don't think so. But I wasn't expecting the right. >> I'm going to let Mr. Diamond speak about break that record. You know my coming up. You may have a you get it right again for everything I have. And how many to what time that we put this room. So we'll have many another 5 minutes allowable for us, Mr. Dimon, go ahead. Obviously profess. I want to thank the city for. >> Everything I do. Thanks for being here. And look, this is a longer conversation. So like if anybody doesn't have my e-mail us our Diamond at Co date on that sending e-mails, your thoughts. Call me. I'm always available in every I never hide. Said I'll invent anything role in about anything as we keep working through this. We're not going to push it through fast. It's just I least I don't. >> Yeah, and I we you know, we've already the furnace once for this very reason. If we need more time like a diamond said we're not in a rush to the system. Yeah, we definitely will want to make sure everybody feels that this is a win for all of Jacksonville. Not just for one side and I know is not one side as well together but want to show we do what's best for the babys. The pets adopted 5 in my life. I recently about that another one from the CPS. So trust me. I'm on the same train as as Mr. Diamond. >> Dogs from Jhs. He's cool. Spend no time in there. Any things he was in prison. He thinks he's got like street cred in there and made in Canada and the I was ready to go ahead. I well, I think. >> As far as these other ones tethering the weight of chains, I think you all are going to be really happy with that. What this does is it gives our officers the ability to hold more people accountable. It's way harder to go out there with the scale and say that this change is overweight. Now we're looking at the dog in our area shows now have the ability to say that this isn't OK. So that's that's really the same for the shelter and the change. A large still in there were still running a large, all that that's still in there. And I can't remember the last one. He said, Vicki, you want something. The affidavits just say your name in Anderson. >> They are and duehren's animal care and protective services. >> So the >> witness question about the affidavits, the affidavits are still in place. It's been changed to right now for us to do anything. We have to have 2 affidavits from 2 different witnesses that do not live together to hold that person accountable for whatever violation occurred. It's down to one. Now it's only one or the day that so if somebody is walking their dog and another dog comes out and bites them before we had to have a second witness that wasn't related to them to hold that dog owner accountable, that's gone away. Now it's down to one witness. >> Just to clarify this, this is really good stuff. Another stray hold can be like looked at one of 2 ways. But these things are going to hold more people accountable for things that we weren't able to do before. So oftentimes there's incidents just like Officer Darren said, there's somebody that saw this lot. This dog get off. The yard are out of their yard. It tried to laundered somebody. We were our hands are tied. The can do anything unless somebody else witnessed it and we need somebody from a different families. Now we need to people from to bring 2 affidavits just to go get this dog that needs to be picked up. So now we've gotten rid of that. So those other ordinances, I yeah, we'll see Saturday if you have any other questions. But yeah, those are way easier to understand or weight makes it way easier for us to be able to hold people accountable. Faith. All right. >> I'm gonna take one more question from the audience and then I have one question for myself that I have from this Norris coming up next. Yes, them coming. >> Is calling mall terror and I am just say community tax payer dog, advocate animal and can I love a CPS? I supported tremendous play. The dogs there want to circle back around to that stray hold the 3, you know, going from 6 to 3 days. I think we kind of some other, but I want to feel really good about doing this before we do it. I think I think areas need to be in place and b, it really needs. It really needs to be effective. The areas that are lacking for this 3 to 6 straight home. We talk about dogs being lost. When you're like I have the right down at that shelter. I'm Karin hate is here from the loss pet page. And we've all been on that. A lot of us utilize that for reuniting dogs back to our community members. And in fact, a lot of dogs get reunited before even making it to the shelter. And what happens is when you lose your dog does not immediately go to the shelter. A dog that is out and wandering oftentimes it takes days. Oftentimes they go into the woods. Oftentimes we call out trappers son. It's a process to get to these dogs and for somebody to finally get it or for the dog finally wear down and make it shipped south visible for somebody to even catch it, to bring it into the shelter. So when exactly is that that the dog makes it into the shelter? Its usually not 24 hours of a dog being lost a bit, making it into the shelters. So this brings into our community are pet owners, the ones out searching that are blasting there side lost this pet. My pet got away and it had no collar on it doesn't have the tags on it. You know? Who knows? You know, no, it's not Mike or tip. Yes, it is. Microchip. Is it registered as an unregistered? Those are all ballad. But the timing of it all, it's not boom, boom, boom. It's not. You know, I'm so in that perspective, 3 extra days is huge for getting these dogs and giving the owners time to reflect. We just had Ed Pogo that was sitting in the shelter's for a year for that owner to finally see it and come in and say that is my dog. He has been lost for a year and huge. I mean, those are huge hope from last year. You know, finally got out on the hounds town video and their family recognize their dog. And the other thing is going into the shelter in picking out your dog. It is a process, right? I mean, it is not that easy to walk months, 400 dogs, 300 dogs and find your dog when the dogs are jumping up and down in spending. And, >> you know, it's just not that easy. As I mean, when we when we look at the base of it, it seems simple, right? Just go down to the shelter and find your dog. I mean, we can say that you have 3 days, you know, on the first day you go to the shelter. You let them know. I know jhs cakes information and and and they put it out there. But they're dealing with 80 dogs, 8200 dogs, city shelters. It's it's a whole different beast, you know. And so so you have, you know, you go to the shelter and then you go back to the shelter and then you go back to the shelter and now somewhere down the line, you start putting flyers how you start the Internet and you start, you know, has I'm got time wrapping back around. I'm still missing my dog. I haven't seen my dog and people that weren't on the Internet one day, maybe on the Internet and other day. So the Internet is not that. >> Saving it is huge, but it's how weak it dogs out. I tell people all the time you want to CPS. Do you work that Internet with that 1 dot? Because you put the post out and then it gets very get another post doubt because you get different eyes on the Internet at different times of the day. And it's just now and then 3 to 6 days. And we're talking about pet owners were talking about barrier language. We're talking about a huge city. You are now need to take into consideration and people believe it or not. Don't use social media. Yeah. Can you believe that there are a lot of people that are not on social media. They don't use it. You know, hope so. I mean, so we're dealing with that. It's that of all different angles of trying to get this dog back home and work talking about 3 to 6 days. You know, we're talking about what is new now. And so I was hoping maybe at the next meeting that chief Barker could explain more into the impact of 3 to 6 days that I personally and confused about as to how a dog will actually be adopted faster. >> Okay. That. >> That confuses me the other. I'm we could have more questions on Saturday because we actually, yeah, I know you're on time on it. So I was maybe, you know, and I can always sit down with him because absolutely you have a lot of yeah, these I don't think we have a such a tight 91 and I do want to put that out. Then anybody please. I mean, his doors open, go sit down with him. Go talk with him. >> You know, because it questions are do it you now there may be things I'm not saying there may be things I'm saying that you didn't think of, you know, it's I do want to say. >> 328 adoptions in November. That is awesome. >> And that is great. Do we know how many got turned away from not having to be able to adopt a dog? >> Within 3, you know the threes. >> And I thank you, Madam. I still have to wrap it up now below account on Saturday, the more the eye. And and also I just want for the for the record, you know, I know, Mr Breaker and this or I could have been doing a great job CPS, but 328 adoptions and a member, our policies because of social media, Mr. Diamond over here, pushing it out there. So thank you so much for you guys. What you do. I I just have one more question for Ms Norris from the ministration. Sir, you have a question as well are. >> Those are I want to know what your problem is. I would like to speak one time. We did it on time today and I do. >> Want to you come up very quick. I want to assure we we always have this conversation. I've already broken the rules here because we're pass our time here. So I know that it will hurt me. >> Say, Sir, I I live on the Eastside of Jacksonville on actually have worked for animal care and protective services in the past. I have a certification as an animal cruelty investigator, dangerous dog investigator. I've looked at this. The proposal change. I'm not against it. I'm one of those personal citizens who have regular concerns as any other person come up a speech and looked at some of the things that negatively affect that way in regards to how animals can be launched in shelters. One of those things versus 3 holes eventually reduce the likelihood of lost pets with united with their family. Studies have shown that owners find their animals within 48 to 72 hours. However, other studies have shown that how are other studies have shown the shelter data shows that most owners don't locate their missing pets immediately. Most pets, many pet owners work long hours, lacquer part lack of transportation or may not even realize that their pet is missing for several hours. In some cases, the animals may wander far from home. We're be picked up as well by on a well-meaning person Weitz a day or more before the animal is taken to the shelter. By the time the owner realize is that the search calls local facilities were sees a photo online photo uploaded. The three-day window may have already closed in money to countries. The three-day includes the day of intake weekends and holidays, which means that the true whole time might effect would be closer than one or 2 business days. As a result, animals are often adopted out transfer to rescues or euthanize before their owners have a chance to locate them short hold, undermine the fundamental purpose of shelters to serve a safety net for lost pets in bridge back home. Second, a shelter environment is already overwhelming constant noise on familiar smells confinement and exposure to disease that may cause the inside a shelter properly evaluating animals for medical care. While inside the shelter for medical needs and releases early may subject to animals to passing on those diseases as long haul periods may not eliminate stress. And Carly, it allows animals to decompress the properly valley received basic medical care before being placed into new environments. A 30 hole can unintentionally contribute to the overcrowding. When cause animals move through the system to quickly, it may seem like turnover is increased. However, the opposite often occurs. Shelter schools do not give staff. Look at a quick time to complete behavioral assessments. Shrinking animals are medically sound for adoption or transfer range matches with appropriate rescue groups. Docs count to require minor medical treatment and fearful and you take or appear to be shut down. Maybe mislabeled to rush the valuations. It may not be placed in some shelter. Short holds push staff to make quick decisions simply to create space which may lead to unnecessary euthanasia properly placement. That reloads results in animals being returned later, returns, increase, shelter populations, rise more pressure on already limited spaces. Additionally, shelters often depend on volunteers, rescue organizations impostors to help manage overcrowding. These groups may need time to plan transfer, secure foster homes and evaluate whether they have for additional animals. 3 D window provides minimal notice and rescues may wish missed the chance to save an animal because the whole place and before they can respond. >> Thank you, sir, as a thank you. I appreciate you. I do hope that you call a Saturday with more information on this day. If you want to reach out to Mister Bricker, just kind of tweak them. I think what to do next on site as well as I was speakers come up. I want to hear they're in favor are opposing this legislation because I think it's important for us to understand where the community wants. You bring a lot of information, but you please send that to my email. Evan was give you my my my this and then I'll review it as well to serve. Yes or like I said, I'm not opposed to. I just have to consider, you know, some concerns as a pet owner. I've had a a that's that I've even bought that from the shelter myself. If my pet gets lost, I would like to have my family member back. Absolutely. Thank you. Thank you, sir. Okay. Miss or is very quick. You know my coming up here, one of the speakers. Yeah. Listen, I want to say was as Vicky brought up a point where actually everybody proud of the same point. The website socks. It's a nice website, but it's terrible. I mean, we spend so much money on it. I've used it. So what can the administration do to make it better? Alright, specially the fight that we've invested so much money and other different departments. So what? >> Here we are. Mayors website looks great at it. >> And just say your name and address for the record. Your role with the administration. >> Bringing our is director of intergovernmental affairs for Mayor Duggan. Thank my addresses on file. You know, it's I think it's far there's always room for improvement on the Web site, right? I think it's just a conversation with director Kendrick and it be determining the different uses and things we would like to accomplish on the website that figure out a timeline to get that stuff built. So anxious to. >> It's true that chairing this meeting. So I mean, let's just let's set a deadline to get this thing like, forget it. It it can't be done overnight bed. >> So I was just this is one of the one welcome mats for the city where it really does matter. It just does like getting the dogs up in the pictures of this past week. And it just matters and it's so hard to find. So I'm whatever that is. I mean now. >> I hear you councilmember. I can't speak for director Kendrick. I will say that I own 2 dogs. One of them is is TVs son of a gun in escapes multiple times. I understand as Fins lawyer. >> Act that defamatory liar. >> Now she's home. >> She escaped from the dog watching the other day 2, it was a whole thing. No. So I think it's a basic meal. But the list of >> the camera, what exactly to call it requirements that we would want to see, right? And then talking with it to see their timeline and capabilities and then from there they can give us a hard answer what they can or can't do with that time looks like to execute. >> So this is that it it's something else. Sure what it was just what we want. >> It reflects that. >> We have a leadership meetings once a month. So our leadership meeting from 2 months ago we came together as a group. >> We looked at a bunch of animal welfare websites. We picked our top 5 favorites and we picked what we wanted our website to do differently. So we've already submitted that it. They're already starting to work on those things. But I do agree that be so cool. If we could have maybe another subcommittee, we can say what we wanted to change. But I would love to hear if there's other things that the public wants, but it is is already currently working on it. >> A roof. >> And in late, I'm not really good at this. I'm Karen. Hey, I run blast pet's of Jacksonville for the past 9 years and supported by the animal control and the Jacksonville Humane Society of we were very close with them every night at a lot. The one thing that I just want to touch on is the communication which I believe we've talked about. We talked about a few things that Lawrence is talking about, putting up separate page with strays, lost and found instead of all mixed in with the 400 dogs. It's easier for that life. But to the point is the communication. So this is this an area and that I get every day people reaching out to me. Oh, my goodness, because our post their dog on the My our group and this is my dog. I've been trying to call been trying to email and I can't get through. So I'll try a day or 2 later. I'm trying to make phone calls. I get no response. And a couple weeks later on get a response in the email that dog got adopted or it's, you know, I don't get any communication if you call those city line. I can understand y'all don't want to direct line because it would be raining all day. The Humane Society. I believe he's put in a pet help center line for the strays for the people reaching out. You have my dog. Can I come get it? I think this will help get them reunited faster with some sort of the communication a little bit better. Now me I were very close with the ACA, isn't everything. And we I have gotten to the point where after a couple days in the owners are panic in by the 4th or 5th day, they that I can finally in touch with somebody I will reach out to the shelter in mission or the AC as and and give them the inner information and they will contact the owner directly and get them home. But it's really on the 5th or 6 stay because we're already trying to okay, I'll help you. Can you make it to the shelter? No, I can't. You know, sometimes all trying run down there. So the owner there are enters that tried to get down there and can't and its use Lee, the 4th or 5th day that we do see finally get in touch with them. I believe that if there wasn't a been communication line, got a great day directly. And and you can bet that Lawson bound Page was great and really helped. So I believe they are making steps. But there are foundations that for it to be successful that need to be addressed for someone is communicate. And when the owner does see their dog, they can call their emails are not getting answered. We hear that every day and it is hard for them to get down there the first couple days. So that's something for them to consider. But. >> Yeah, thank you for list. 43 say. >> Okay. So I actually had my last year. One of the things that that we could also for Percy with in the future will be like some a dedicated team just specifically for this cause. But nevertheless, we have a lot more conversation to come. Thank you, everybody, for joining us today. I will see hope for the most, if not all of you on Saturday at 01:00PM at the Southeast Regional Library meeting is adjourned